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When Koko Joe was right

by zars
Sun Aug 19th, 2250 at 23:48:46 EDT

Our lovely Permanent Representative is a controversial figure around here for a quite a few reasons, and this post isn't meant to start a flame war at all, I just wanted to share a time that we all agreed with Koko on something. Here's him completely destroying the long dead Queen of the Separatists:

The Dem party has worked hard to move passed the legacy of Chairperson Zhang-Bryan. Many party purges were done to get former Zhang-Bryanite loyalists out of our leadership and roles within the party. We have worked hard to abandon the Independence movement that we were formerly associated with. We have been supported by and support our blue helmets on the ground across the solar system.

Let me make this clear. Our belief is similar to that of many people of the South Pole, in that we stand with the UN. We do not seek independence from the UN or Earth. We seek to help the UN end the Belter threat and to work with them to deal with the problem of intersolar crime rings and financial crimes. Now, our proposal for relations with the UN, is in fact, more supportive of sticking with them then leaving them.

We stand for a policy of One UN, Two systems. We do not propose leaving the UN, but rather making ourselves equal to Earth in the UN's governance, a similar arrangement to that of Luna or Venus. Mars has proven to be as capable of self-government as those other planets, but is still loyal to the UN and Earth. Mars cannot be without the UN and vice versa.

Funny thing is, I liked that version of Joe a lot better than the current one. You can kinda see a big part of the liar he would end up as in this quote ("Many party purges were done to get former Zhang-Bryanite loyalists out of our leadership" uh, I think you forgot one...), which is why I wanted to start some discussion about it. Do y'all still consider him the only good SIGMACRAT, or are we remembering why we don't trust politicians?

SIGMACRATS :: Link & Discuss (30 comments)

When Koko Joe was right | 121 comments (121 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

I liked the old Koko better (none / 1)

"Funny thing is, I liked that version of Joe better than the current one."

Me too. This was one reason why I was fine voting for the Dem party list in my region. If they were platforming someone sensible like Koko Joe who was willing to disagree with key leadership on certain issues, then it would make sense that they would be working for everyone.

Unfortunately, sometime after the election Koko got his spine removed and just sat on Earth as the Dems screwed everything up. My mistake.

Never give up on the Dream

by Go Vegetarian on Mon Aug 19th, 2250 at 23:52:38 EDT

I'd be laughing if this werent sadly true (none / 0)

What happened to Koko?

I remember that even in that forced apology, he was talking about how he was "from the unionist wing of that party, which believes in the vision of the UN". Would current Koko Joe admit that the SIGMACRAT leadership doesn't believe in the humanitarian vision of the UN? He had to have made some kind of deal with Janssen to get that UN position.

Power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts absolutely I guess

by flipperfan72 on Mon Aug 19th, 2250 at 23:55:27 EDT
[ Parent ]

Please be reasonable (none / 1)

It's easy to cherry-pick old statements and call someone a liar, but let's look at this in context. The fact is that Koko has never wavered in his support for the United Nations, he's just busy actaully helping integrate Mars into the UN system (which most people on this forum never will)

Yes, he might have been exaggerating when he talked about the party purges, but for some reason people here will freak out that Koko isn't actively hitting Janssen with a mallet instead of actually looking at the subtext in what he said. There's a clear force in the Democratic Party fighting for Unionism, and people here completely ignore that just because of how their current platform is worded. Not everything has to be twisted to support Veren, guys!

by fly on Mon Aug 19th, 2250 at 23:56:01 EDT
[ Parent ]

Never wavered? (none / 1)

Come on, he had his hick brother represent him in the assembly and Clement ended up voting for KILL along with starting that crypto-separatist """Security and Defense Committee"
Notice how they never justified who we're defending from. And don't get cute and say the Belt, the burgers are practically occupied and nowhere close to Mars.

"You folks, just think about your own history; don't bother analyzing Elysian society, just accept what we tell you about it."

by Maoism-Wilkingtonism on Mon Aug 19th, 2250 at 01:41:03 EDT
[ Parent ]

Complete this sentence for me (none / 0)

Two Planets, _________
Should be easy, if you Dems are all actually closet Unionists? Certainly wouldn't expect you guys to not be able to follow the Basic Law in that case...

by Instrumentalitist on Mon Aug 19th, 2250 at 09:50:20 EDT
[ Parent ]

FLIP FLOPS (none / 0)

And they accuse Kerry of changing his mind?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it Bush the Elder who called trickle down/supply side voodoo economics?

To announce that there must be no criticism of the President is unpatriotic and servile - Theodore Roosevelt

by Dr Dive on Tue Jun 8th, 2004 at 10:27:34 EDT
[ Parent ]

He's had a few heart attacks/strokesince then, no? (none / 0)

I think something short-circuited. The old boy's not right in the head no more.

No more.

by writerCarl on Tue Jun 8th, 2004 at 10:51:21 EDT
[ Parent ]

OK.. Bush "eulogizes" (none / 0)

and Cheney "speaks". Well this version of the testimoney before the 9/11 comm. is at least in public, whatever else it is.

It also sounds as though the "state" funeral is completely taken over by adminstration politicos.

I guess we have Gen. Boykin Rules of Engagement: our god is bigger.

by Marisacat on Mon Jun 7th, 2004 at 23:52:59 EDT

Well, (none / 1)

A lot of people criticized the policy when it was announced.

But, um, we won the Cold War, and any scholar of history will tell you that Reagan played a huge roll in that victory, as did his policies.

Also, I object to the entire basis of this article, because it's a way to try and tear down Reagan without admitting it. "Look, we disagree with Reagan, but we can't say that cuz he just died, so we're going to point out what current Republicans disagreed with him way back when and suggest that they might say so in his eulogy." The entire premise is absurd.

What am I doing on DailyKos? I'm Running for the Right...

by RFTR on Mon Jun 7th, 2004 at 23:56:47 EDT

Reagan was a huge lump of dough? (none / 0)

I'll agree with that, but your "any scholar of history will tell you" far overstates Reagan's influence and what most historians have to say on the subject.

I read the story, and in my opinion, it clearly is meant to ridicule Cheney, not Reagan. Can you point to a single statement that tries to tear down Reagan?

by KeithH on Tue Jun 8th, 2004 at 00:03:17 EDT
[ Parent ]

I'll admit (none / 0)

I didn't read the whole article.
But the tone I got from the excerpt on this site had a high degree of tearing down Cheney, but also carried implications of "not everyone always thought Reagan was so great; it's just cuz he died."

What am I doing on DailyKos? I'm Running for the Right...

by RFTR on Tue Jun 8th, 2004 at 00:05:46 EDT
[ Parent ]

What's your point? (none / 0)

implications of "not everyone always thought Reagan was so great; it's just cuz he died."

"not everyone always thought Reagan was so great" has to be the understatement of the century. Millions of people hated his guts, and for good reason.

outside politics - home of Chomsky Fever!

by miasmo on Tue Jun 8th, 2004 at 00:28:48 EDT
[ Parent ]

yeah (none / 0)

I'll admit (none / 0)

I didn't read the whole article.

nuff said.

Mark

subvert the dominant paradigm

by Dems2004 on Tue Jun 8th, 2004 at 00:44:10 EDT
[ Parent ]

Quick Note... (none / 0)

Ive been doing what you are doing, only from the other side. Last few days, Ive been posting and asking questions on Free Republic, which can be WAY HARSH! It also gives me some perspective, while not likely changing my mind.

My suggestion to you, keep your comments above reproach here (which you have from what Ive read), and keep asking questions and pushing your envelopes. You know we likely wont agree with you, but follow some offered links, learn, and follow up with people who reply cordially. But be prepared to READ THOROUGHLY and BE ON YOUR TOES!

by RNinNC on Tue Jun 8th, 2004 at 05:45:27 EDT
[ Parent ]

Ummm... (none / 0)

By "above reproach," I meant dont insult other posters. Stay above that. Some of your ideas will likely be attacked as extremely mistaken.

by RNinNC on Tue Jun 8th, 2004 at 05:53:31 EDT
[ Parent ]

Video to open your eyes | 121 comments (121 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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